Take profit out of medical care

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Petunia - 2009-12-21 07:51:10

You do make some valid points, but in the case of your daughter, I can assure you there would be no more compassion from governmant run health care. Actually, I would expect much less compassion. I agree with Rob. The well being of the public is absolutely not the motive the liberals in our government have in mind. It concerns me deeply that the majority of the public believes in this concept. True, there is too much corruption in the medical field, but I believe there is MUCH more corruption in the government and the more control we give them, the more we give up our rights a little bit at a time.

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Mike Morgan - annapolis, md - Karma: Excellent

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Hospitals again - 2009-12-19 00:07:54

Im not out to get the doctors. We need Doctor Bob, just as much as we need Engineer Sally, or Electrician Jim. The system is seriously screwed up and I dont claim to have all of the answers either.

Just for everyones amusement, we paid the hospital several $1000 the day after my daughter was admitted. The ins co paid the hospital well over $350,000.00 before she was even released. The other $90,000.00 they paid shortly thereafter. That left a balance of a few $1000 dollars that she was reponsible for. Since she was given heavy duty painkillers for 6 wks her body became addicted and she had to be weened off of it with methadone (the same stuff they give heroin fiends) that I was responsible for giving her several times a day for 3-4 weeks. She was also peeing through a tube for several wks after her release. Even though we were "responsible" enough to maintain insurance, pd the hospital $1000's upfront and hundreds of thousands of dollars from the insurance company, they began legal proceedings within weeks of her release while my daughter was still laying flat on her back. Absolutely zero compassion or concern.

If it wasnt for us she would have lost her house and everything else she owned before she was even walking again. You dont know how close you are to living in a cardboard box until you have to go through something like this, and it wasnt even a major injury although when she left she left with what the doctors described in laymans terms as a "massive hernia" (they made the massive hernia so they could get inside and hose her down every few days).

To repair the massive hernia was a "selective surgery" which means that a larger portion of that procedure was also our responsibility since we "selected to do it". The other "selection" was to leave my daughter permanently disabled.

So, sorry Corina, but unfortunately I do have some idea of how the heatlhcare system works. Good luck to all.....your going to need it!

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Petunia Fields - pasadena, md - Karma: Bad

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Hospitals - 2009-12-18 21:08:36

non-profit status is challenged all the time. But as long as un-compensated care equals the taxes they would pay, that won't change. Most local hospital execs earn much less than the union-member stacked dept's of education.

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Peter Dennis - Annapolis, MD - Karma: Neutral

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Strictly the facts, aka reality - 2009-12-18 18:05:12

Obscene profit margins have no place in the medical industry if were ever to have a truely civilized society.

If the industry cant control there own greed & self serving impulses, then they need to be more tightly regulated by us the people (the government). It has nothing to do with communism.

And if the hospitals didnt charge $1200- for a bottle of aspirin or $260.00 for a box of band aids then most of us wouldnt have the need for $900.00/month insurance policies in the first place.

Furthermore, who do you do you think has to support all of these people whos lives were destroyed(forced into bankruptcy) by short hospitals stays that results in tens of thousands of dollars worth of debt, or in the case of my oldest daughter, $450,000 for a 6 wk stay to treat a simple puncture wound.

As for most hospitals already being operated as non profit organizations. Do you think that means that the doctors are working for free? are we still in wonderland or did we move on to oz? It means that the guys sitting on the board decide how much money they will pay themselves and whatever is left is tax exempt. So they can take the tax exempt portion of the proceeds and add to there fleet of private jets and 25 mil dollar private oceanfront compounds in the Bahamas, hold there corporate meetings there all tax free of course since its "non profit".

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Petunia Fields - pasadena, md - Karma: Bad

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Bleak vision - 2009-12-17 21:24:10

Its just Obama waging his 60's class warfare to expand his power: first it was the "fat cats" on wall street (he wussed out on this one), then the evil insurance companies (people laugh when he says the government is going to make private insurers competitive?) but he is also against the doctors who give you surgery instead of painkillers, and who remove tonsels for the hell of it.

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Charles Carroll - Annapolis, MD - Karma: Terrible

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Problem is - 2009-12-17 16:56:38

60% of hospitals are already not-for-profit, and the bulk of the rest are government run.

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Peter Dennis - Annapolis, MD - Karma: Neutral

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Sighhh... - 2009-12-17 15:13:52

I only wish people like Petunia had an inkling as to how the healthcare system is set up. See, your doctor can charge WHATEVER he wants for his services. The insurance company will only reimburse a fraction of that.Say you go to the doctor, and they bill the insurance company $175 for the 5 minutes you see them . It doesn't mean they get $175 dollars back. Probably more like $60. Physicians have a prenegotiated contract with all insurers where they agree to accept a lesser payment for their services in return for being in that insurers network. That means they get more patients. I have worked in the medical field for years and have never known any physician to look at a patient as a "blank check". That is proposterous.

Secondly- "survival rates of seriously inured people both with and without medical policies." Total fallacy. If you are seriously injured, the last thing the ER staff is asking you when you are brought in via ambulance and being worked on by 5-10 ER staff at the same time is whether you have insurance. That is ridiculous. The job is to stabilize the patient. Period. "When it's given away to the uninsured, including huge numbers of illegals, the rest of us pay or hospitals close." This I have to say is a big reason why healthcare is so expensive. The hospital has to turn a profit, and if they can get even some of their self-pay patients to pay something to cover what the other self-pay patients don't, then they are doing good. Unfortunately, Petunia, if you want socialist healthcare, you can have it, and the tax increase that will eventually come with it. I prefer to pay my $25 copay, my monthly premiums, and go about my business.

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Corina Z - Mayo, MD - Karma: Excellent

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Rampant greed? - 2009-12-17 09:56:30

Let me clue you into something.... The insurnace industry, the left's favorite whipping boy, is squarely #35 of the 52 major industries tracked by Bloomberg in terms of profit margin. You know what's ahead of them? Things like Soda, paper products, building supplies, beer, fast food, etc. Since when did making a profit become immoral or illegal? That is what has made us into the greatest nation on earth, why people are clammoring to get in here by any means necessary. Is there some ridiculousness in the medical industry? Sure, but that's for the free market to sort out, not the governement. Everything the government touches goes bankrupt and is the model of inneficiency... look at what they run.... the post office, social security, medicare, THE DMV!!!!! Gee, that's really who I want determining my healthcare choices! Also, healthcare is not a RIGHT. It is a privilage. You do not have the right to be happy, only to pursue happiness unimpeded by government (read the constitution sometime, you'll learn something). Somehow we made it the first 200 years just fine and turned into the world's #1 economy and superpower without "free" healthcare, foodstamps, welfare, cradle to grave entitlements. It just must be the world's #1 coincidence that when the social engineers took over everything started going to hell. The problem with socialism though is eventually you run out of everyone else's money. This is nothing more than a power grab by Emperor Obama, Princess Pelosi and Dingy Harry. Keep drinking the koolaid folks...

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Steve Gorman - Timonium, MD - Karma: Neutral

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Awesome - 2009-12-17 09:25:10

The Capital has deteriorated into publishing the most ridiculous letters to the Editor in order to generate high comments. But this is just a continuation of the Editor saying he won't publish anything about any local businesses that don't advertise with them, and then went on a personal vendetta against the county executive. Marquardt keep wondering if anyone is going to pay for your opinion pieces.

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Peter Dennis - Annapolis, MD - Karma: Neutral

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Stay with facts please - 2009-12-16 20:13:09

I drive a Chevy and own a local business that employs 20 people, do not lecture me on my spending habits. You make way to many gratuitous assertions.

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Rob Marcus - Riva, MD - Karma: Excellent

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Re: Some Wild Assumptions Here - 2009-12-16 19:03:24

Yes I agree its a wild and terrifying comment, yet according to Harvard Universities own studies it is an accurate comment.

Just search Yahoo for "number one cause of bankruptcies" and you'll find many credible examples that have came to the same conclusion.

I think the fact that most of the doctors down at the local hospital participate in a profit sharing plan says a lot. Personally I dont need a doctor thats providing medical care for me or my family making financial decisions for the hospital or her year end bonus. I would prefer that he/she concentrate on making appropriate medical decisions.

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Petunia Fields - pasadena, md - Karma: Bad

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Some Wild Assumptions Here - 2009-12-16 18:22:03

'Rampant crime and greed in the health system' hardly constitute the 'number-one cause of bankruptcy' in America. In vastly more bankruptcy cases, irresponsible credit-card spending that exceeds one's income is at fault. (Reminds me of a certain Congress, but that's another discussion.) Health care costs money. When it's given away to the uninsured, including huge numbers of illegals, the rest of us pay or hospitals close. Yes, there's greed, but much (most?) of it is in frivolous malpractice suits that drive malpractice premiums skyward for docs, hospitals, and insurance companies. A recent AP article published data showing that the most profitable insurance company (Aetna) nets just under 6% profit after taxes.

Not sure how you know that Rob drives a Mercedes, Petunia, or that his spending habits need 'fine tuning' . . . ??

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Tina Chite - Churchton, MD - Karma: Excellent

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Re: Expand on that premise - 2009-12-16 17:59:26

Rampant greed and crime in the health system is the number one cause of bankruptcy in America. So yes, outsource the positions if neccessary and provide a free education to those that are willing to dedicate at least a portion of there careers in the US.

And then your concerned about the loss of jobs in America, then trade in your Mercedes and buy an American car and then fine tune your buying habits from there.

As for spending hundreds of thousands of dollars for an education and then using that as justification to rob the public doesnt seem to make a lot of sense either. I am a small business owner and spend 6 figures of my income on advertising EAch and EVery year. But that doesnt mean that I feel im entitled to take advantage of those that come to me for assistance. I do make an exception is some cases though, if a person insists on being addressed as "Doctor", then that normally costs them an extra $100- in freight charges. A simple and respectful Yes sir is free.

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Petunia Fields - pasadena, md - Karma: Bad

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Expand on that premise - 2009-12-16 08:43:17

Ok, then let's expand on that premise. For your rationale to work, then we would need to offer to anyone who wants it a FREE Medical school education. You really do not expect someone to invest hundreds of thousands of dollars to work for Civil Service Gov Scale salary do you? Then, to meet the demand of Drs versus patients you dilute the talent pool, not to mention the potential doctors who will be wise to seek a more rewarding career elsewhere further diluting the talent pool. OH yeah, free trade and Importing doctors from India sounds good, like outsourcing other American held jobs. The free market capitalistic system is what we have here, you can not have it both ways. Either surrender your entire life to government control or stay with what we have, there is no in between. While your idea may be noble, it is also naive.

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Rob Marcus - Riva, MD - Karma: Excellent

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Price Gouging - 2009-12-15 20:25:47

And while im here id like to make another comment. Does anyone remember the hard working gentleman from Louisiana that was prosecuted for price gouging several years ago after marking up the little bit of gasoline that he had left after a hurricane sturkc and disrupted the supply line. I bleieve that he marked it up a mere 50% over the going rates and this was enough to have him labeled as a criminal.

Has anyone ever asked for an itemized invoice after a hospital or doctors visit? Perhaos someone could explain to me why its ok to charge $8.00 for a single Tylenol, $6.00 for a regular band aid or $6000.00 for 2 hours of "therapy" (a nurse walking behind someone with a wheelchair through the halls of the hospital is apparently a form of therapy that justifys a $3000.00 per hour salary). As far as I know theres no shortages of bank aids or Tylenol in America, so other than the supply and demand aspect, how is this any different from the working man in LA selling his products on a higher yet reasonable margin during a time when the product is in great demand and low supply?

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Petunia Fields - pasadena, md - Karma: Bad

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Profit Sharing plan for Doctors - 2009-12-15 20:11:56

Im not really sure where to start with this. The medical system is corrupt. Many eons ago people aspired to be doctors because they enjoyed helping people in need and gained personal satisfaction from it. Now its all about the money, at least here in the USA. Theres still millions of people around the world that choose to be in this profession for nothing more than an average paycheck and the personal satisfaction they get from helping those in need. How many doctors in your history books needed an accountant to manage there money? how many were part of a profit sharing plan? is anyone aware of the fact that most of the surgeons around the country negotiate for profit sharing plans as part of there compensation packages? in other words the doctors that are working to save your sons or daughters life can fatten there christmas bonuses just by deciding who is worthy of treatment (those with insurance?) and those that arent worthy. It would be interesting to see some statistics comparing the survival rates of seriously inured people both with and without medical policies. And if that isnt scary enough, I sometimes wonder which is the biggest threat, becoming seriously ill and having no insurance, or having insurance and knowing that the doctors could view me as a blank check and subject me to excessive and needless treatments that only prolongs my stay. And then knowing that the insurance company might prefer to see me dead rather than alive and requiring long term treatment (its cheaper to bury someone than to provide long term health care) is equally unnerving.

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Petunia Fields - pasadena, md - Karma: Bad

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No-Profit Medical Care? NOT! - 2009-12-15 19:25:05

There must be (reasonable) profit in medical care, or we'll have no medical care. Most
graduating MDs usually have educational loans to repay, plus costs incurred in setting themselves up in practice. (Then there are those pesky malpractice-insurance premiums to contend with -- fodder for another discussion on frivolous lawsuits.) Eliminating profit eliminates incentive, which eliminates medical care.

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Tina Chite - Churchton, MD - Karma: Excellent

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Are You For Real? - 2009-12-15 16:36:07

I know, let's all join hands and sing Kumbaya while we're at it. It'd be great if the only driving force needed for innovation was altruism. Unfortunately this is the real world, not fantasy land, and people strive for the betterment of their family, themselves and their place of employment (or their own company if they own it) usually in that order. This involves money. There's a reason why people come here from all over the world to seek the best and most complicated medical treatments available. That is because we have the last free market medical system left, something liberals are desperate to tear down in the interest of exerting more control over society. If you think for one second this is about providing better care instead of making you more beholden to Government, I have some oceanfront land in Colorado to sell you. Where is the incentive to create new treatments, new drugs, new machines if you can't make any money at it? We've tried that, it's called the Soviet Union, Cuba, etc and it failed miserably. Why is there now a booming "medical tourism" industry in Canada where people are paying to fly to India to get hip replacements because there's a 3 year waiting list? Because of government rationing. "Trickle Up Poverty" is what we are being fed by the Obama administration and I'm having none of it.

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Steve Gorman - Timonium, MD - Karma: Neutral